Guy Bauer | Umault
This week on The Inbound Success Podcast, Umault Founder Guy Bauer shares his approach to creating business videos that people actually love to watch, and that also get results.
Guy is the author of the book “Death to the Corporate Video”, and the host of a podcast by the same name, and has made it his mission to put an end to boring corporate videos. In this week’s episode, he shares what he calls “the mullet strategy” for making great videos, and breaks down specific do’s and don’ts.
If you’re thinking of using video as part of your business marketing strategy, or already have videos that aren’t performing well, this episode is for you.
Check out the full episode to hear Guy’s insights.
Resources from this episode:
Visit the Umault website
Connect with Guy on LinkedIn
Check out the Death to the Corporate Video podcast
Guy and Kathleen recording this episode
Kathleen (00:19):
Welcome back to the inbound success podcast. I am your host Kathleen Booth. This week. My guest is Guy Bauer, who is the founder and creative director at Umault. Welcome to the podcast Guy.
Guy (00:33):
Thanks for having me, Kathleen. Nice to be here.
Kathleen (00:35):
Nice to have you. We're talking about video and I feel like everybody is either doing video these days or wants to do video or knows they should do video, but isn't doing anything. You know, it's, it's, I think in the last three to four years, it's really gone from being a nice to have or an extra two to an absolute like table stakes thing and marketing. And so I'm interested to talk about your take on really the best way to do video for businesses. But before we get into that, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and your story and what Umault is?
Guy (01:17):
Sure. So I'm a video nerd. I have been since the seventh grade, I started in my seventh grade English class doing a Ricky Ticky Tavi video. And since then I've been hooked to the feeling of like entertaining through this medium of motion picture. I, but that's not where my career took. I actually went to Purdue for aerospace engineering and dropped out and got into TV and radio. And video was just my side hobby. And then in the recession, 2009, got laid off sent out a hundred resumes. Didn't go on one interview. And so there you go. That's how I started an agency 2010 and just kept growing and growing and growing. And along the way made every single bad video possible. And in 2018, after eight years of doing it most of the wrong way, but some of the right way, I kind of put all the patterns together of like, wait a second, how come this portion of our work is so successful and our clients are raving and it's so effective. And then this portion is terrible and not effective. And if you go on YouTube to this day, there's 36 views. I kind of put two and two together and started Umault out of that. And our whole motto is kind of death to the corporate video. And that's what we found that was the insight is that the video that stinks that doesn't work, it can be bucketed under quote unquote corporate video.
Kathleen (02:47):
Oh, that's interesting. I mean, I would say the world is littered with corporate videos. And I'm curious to hear more about like how you would define that, but then I also something I want to talk about as we have this conversation, I just had, I just had this discussion the other day at work and it's probably the 20th time, at least that I've had it in, in my career where somebody is like, well, why can't we just make a viral video, like dollar shave club? And I'm like, if it was that easy to make a viral video, don't you think everybody would be doing it? So I guess let's start with, you talked about death to the corporate video. Can you define what you mean by corporate video?
Guy (03:30):
I can, I can flip that upon on you because how is it that we're in totally different spheres, right. And yet I say, yeah, our whole motto is death to the corporate video. And you're like, yeah. I mean, it's all around. Like, how is it? We both know what corporate video is. Corporate video is basically just a nice way to say soulless video video that offers no entertainment value. That's boring, hard to watch all about whatever your, like, just the topic or the product, like no service delivers no value. All of these things are corporate video and we all kind of feel like one of the, one of the pieces of feedback we get from clients we used to get thankfully, not anymore, but it's, they're like, eh, it just feels corporate. Right? And you're like, ah, I don't want to be corporate. And so corporate videos, just that, that stuff that has no empathy, it's just all about, oh, we were started in 1972 as a family owned business, structuring over 15 countries and all about you and, and boring and just talking heads, sweaty executives, looking into the camera with like, just trying to remember what they're supposed to say.
Guy (04:47):
B roll of people, smiling and pointing at computers in slow motion, walking down hallways. I mean, this is corporate video. It's just terrible.
Kathleen (04:57):
So this is, and I, I totally know exactly the type of video you're talking about, but I want to play devil's advocate because I imagine there's people listening who are saying, yup, I get that. But there are times when people really do want to hear like the company history or there are times when people really do want to hear, like, what does the product do or how does it work? And so are you saying like you shouldn't make those videos, are you saying there's a better way to make them
Guy (05:26):
Great question? I'm saying the one size, so around like the mid two thousands early two or 2000 tens, there was this whole thing of tell your story, right. I don't know if you remember that, but it was like huge. You have to be a storyteller. And so everyone went into, well, let's tell our company's story, but what happened was, and that's when, you know, you got the, we started in 1972 as a family owned, yada yada, but that what I'm against is no, I mean, those kind of overview are fine. They're great for your about page or for recruiting or whatever, but what I'm against is the one size fits all approach where, well, we've made that corporate video. Let's put that on Facebook and let's, and, and like kind of with all disregard to a funnel or empathizing with where their prospects are in their buyer's journey, they just throw product videos and corporate videos and overview or whatever, and, and kind of Willy nilly and the way I kind of sum this up, this kind of one size fits all.
Guy (06:33):
If you bear with me, I've like a metaphor. So if you think of sales and this is borrowed from Blair ends, if you think of sales as a two-step process of step one, you need to inspire someone, step two, you need to reassure. So an early stage buyer, you need to inspire them of like, they're like, imagine a world in which you can reach your desired future state, right? Yes. Okay. That's inspiration. But then as your prospect gets closer and closer to cutting you a check, they don't need to be inspired anymore. They need to be reassured like this is going to work. We've done this before we have, you know, 80 clients here's testimonials here's, you know, yada yada. So step one, inspire step two reassure. And if you think about the inspire person or like, think of inspire as like a person, right?
Guy (07:31):
Like a rock star, like a long haired rock star, that's what you need in a rock star. Screams, is cool. Has cool riffs, but underneath is kind of empty, right? There's not much meat there. So that's the, the inspire that's what gets you attention. And then as you get closer to the sale, imagine reassure as like a business guy, close cropped hair, all about the numbers. This is going to work 80% of our clients, yada, yada, yada, all that stuff. That's a person with short hair. And this is where I get to that. The big mistake brands make is they do this one size fits all. They try to make a video and content that both inspires and reassures at the same time. And what ends up, what ends up happening when you combine a long hair haircut with a short haired haircut is you get in the middle, you get a mullet.
Guy (08:28):
And so, you know, short hair up front, long hair in the back, you get these all purpose pieces of video. That is good for no one really like it, it doesn't inspire because it has too much reassure content in it. And it doesn't really reassure because it's got too much inspire content. I guess it's for the person that's directly in the middle of their buyer's journey. Yes. But other than that, like, it's not this one size, all, that's a fallacy. And so that's where I get this anti kind of corporate video stance is that it's just like making one thing and that thing that you just kind of throw it up everywhere.
Kathleen (09:06):
All right. So somebody comes to you and they say, and it's a business and they say, I want to do video. And they might even say, I want to do a corporate video, or I want to do corporate explainer. Right? Like that's always a big term. Break down for me how you tear that apart and rebuild it into a strategy that you believe in.
Guy (09:30):
Fundamentally here's the big issue is that you're exactly right. A few years ago, video was a nice to have. Now it's a table stake. So a few years ago it didn't matter the quality or the message really. It was like, whoa, you got a video. That's so cool. But now everyone has that same video. And so what?
Guy (09:56):
People have to understand is that to make a great video dollar shave club or a great video, any name, any great video or a great ad when you break it down to its core, it's really an idea that is transmitted through the medium of video. What you're, what you're interacting with with dollar shave club is just a notion. It's like just kind of material that is transmitted to you through video. So the most important thing you need when making a video is an idea. And here's another way to look at it. When you go build a custom house, you don't talk your first call isn't to a carpenter or to a plumber to start plumbing the house, your first call. If you want to build a custom houses to an architect and the architect, isn't going to ask you questions like, well, what kind of lumber do you want to use?
Guy (10:51):
They're going to ask you questions. Like, tell me about your lifestyle. Like, are you an outdoor person, indoor? Do you like watch movies with, do you do crafts? It's all like this big picture thinking. And the end deliverable of the architect, isn't the finished house, it's the blueprint. And then that blueprint gets handed to a general contractor who then hires the framer, the plumber, the electrician, the video making the big mistake that brands are making is they go direct to the general contractor who hires the plumber, the electrician, but they don't hand the general contractor blueprints. And what happens is, is the general contractor. And that is a video production company. In this case, we'll pick blueprints out from the library, the public domain of ideas, and they'll go, oh, look, your competitor has a thing where the CEO does that. Let's just take that off the shelf, that blueprint and go for it.
Guy (11:48):
So the biggest thing that you need to start with where we try to tear down and get out of the corporate video trap is instead of asking you questions, like how many cameras do you want? What day of this is the shoot it's like, tell me about your company. Like, isn't this so weird. I mean, it's not like it's any different than any other beginning of a marketing campaign. You ask about the goals and the objectives and things like that. But that's the big mistake is like, Hey, we need a video. Let's call a video production company. No, you actually need an idea. First, you need a creative agency. And so that's where kind of this, the fundamental root of all this stuff happens. And that's really what our mission is, is to educate once we get that point across you know, the clients who want to work with us are then game for like, all right, well, let's, let's program this video. Like it's a, you know, like let's program the idea and transmitted through video instead of putting all the pressure on just like when's the shoot day. Right?
Kathleen (12:49):
So putting on your hat as the video creative agency you know, there's obviously a lot of different types of videos that companies make. And I would say that let's, let's start with an explainer, like a product explainer. Cause I'm actually thinking about this right now, for something I'm working on. Walk me through the process. You talked about how an architect would ask all these questions, like walk me through the process that you use to figure out what that idea is that should drive the video. Yeah.
Guy (13:22):
And so I'm a very lazy person. I'm from New Jersey. I don't know what that means, but I'm a lazy person. Well, put it this way. I don't like to use, we don't have much creative energy as humans. We have like a little bit, if you think about like a video game, when you play mortal combat, you know, you have like this energy and then you do a special move and the energy goes down. So I use what's called the subtractive method and it's kind of borrowed from, there was a sculptor whoever didn't oh, is it Michaelangelo? The, one of the sculptors said, you know, that the sculpture is in, there is in the rock. I just need to let them out. I need to take away the stuff around David. It was David. You know, David was in the rock, I just needed to take away the rock.
Guy (14:13):
He was already in there. So the idea is this is that to come up with a great idea for a video isn't just us sitting in a room going like, like trying to come up with an idea. What you need to do is create the box first, define the box that all the ideas need to fit in. And so that's where we get into creative strategy. So asking questions like you know, what is the objective, tell me about what you want people to do after watching this, where does this fit in the funnel? So the explainer video needs to fit further down in the funnel because before you even are watching an explainer, that means that you're now that has to be consideration or lower in the funnel or else, why would you watch an explainer? That means, you know, explainer means you're wanting to be reassured and learn more about this solution.
Guy (15:08):
So really identify where in the funnel is this piece of content going. And then the biggest piece that I love is the competitive analysis. So look at your direct and indirect competitors and just look at what they're doing. And what you're trying to do is find a pattern. You're trying to find what the consensus is in the marketplace. And then once you identify that consensus just don't do that. And that's kind of where really the, the box that we have to play in gets solidified. We, we put constraints on the concept. Now, nine times out of 10, what happens is out of that competitive analysis. And then just out of asking the stakeholders about the brand, like, tell me about what you do. Tell me about what you do nine times out of 10. I swear to Kathleen, they tell me the idea in one of those discovery sessions, and I kind of write it down, bookmark it. And then lo and behold, that was like, they didn't even realize they had the idea in them, but it all starts with defining a box because then you're not having to conjure up some great idea out of thin air. It's actually easier if you have to play inside of a box.
Kathleen (16:27):
So you talked about this competitive analysis thing, and this is really interesting to me about looking at what your competitors are doing and then doing something different, right? Like they go, they're going to all go and left you go. Right? I believe in this strongly, I really like to just be kind of nonconformist as a strategy. But a lot of people have a hard time with this. And so I do think there are folks that go out and they look at like, well, here's the leader in our space and this is what they're doing. And so they must know something we don't. How do you talk through with your customers? Like, look, you're a law firm. Every other law firm is doing it this way, but this isn't the best way to do it. How do you convince them of that?
Guy (17:10):
Well, not everyone is convincible, but I use you've seen Hamilton, right? Yeah. Okay. So in Hamilton there's Hamilton is the good guy. And then you got Aaron Burr's the bad guy, Aaron Burr wanting to be popular. Aaron Burr did not want to polarize. Aaron Burr, even after we won the war was unwilling to side with the United States. He was like, ah, I don't know how this is going to shake out. He wanted everyone to love him. He didn't want to offend anyone. He always went with consensus always. And 200, whatever years later, he's the bad guy. And he killed Hamilton. Hamilton on the other hand, didn't mind who he polarized and he spoke his mind and he wasn't always right, but he spoke his mind. And so with that, combined with another deck, I have, I make clients sit through a, half-hour kind of just like theory deck.
Guy (18:10):
You sway and, and guess what? Not all of our clients get swayed. And a lot of the clients are like, I'm never working with you because it's way too dangerous. But you know, the idea of conformity and I call it consensus. It's like, it's out of human survival. Like if, when we were cave people and you saw a hundred cave, people crossing a river on the left and no one crossing it on the right. You're like, okay, well obviously the crowd is correct here. Like there, you know, that must be a safe place to cross. And so it's out of this whole safety vibe. The problem is in business consensus, I E safety is, is not safety. There's this false assumption. That consensus means safety. That if apple is doing it, that it must be writer, name, whoever number one is in your industry, that it must be correct. No wrong. It's actually dangerous to be safe in the world of business. Like we must be contrarian and guess what? It's not always going to work, but it's still better than, than just doing what everyone else does. If all you're doing is adding to white noise when you do what everyone else does, that's it.
Kathleen (19:29):
So if I want to kind of now get into some nitty gritty details. And I know obviously every video strategy is going to be different for every client, because it depends on all the factors that you've already mentioned. Having said that though, are there, do you have kind of a list of things that you're like, never do this? Like, I'll give you an example in marketing on my list of never do this. One of them has never used the font comic Sans, right? So like, what are the things in video where you're like, you see this happen a lot out there, but I say never do these things.
Guy (20:05):
I'll give you a oh, I have so many nevers. Okay. The biggest one I offender I see is is making your people memorize things like interviewing your CEO and giving them like lines to memorize. Unless you're CEO now, I've been in this business for 11 years professionally, and I can tell you even trained, paid actors struggle to deliver lines in an authentic manner. Now, what are the odds that your CEO who doesn't have any acting training, who doesn't do this on a daily basis is going to deliver these lines with authenticity and believability. And what happens is, is people get focused on the CEO, nailing the lines, and they totally ignore that. The CEO is like at our company, we have like this crazy odd performance. And what people don't realize is it's not what the CEO is saying. It's how the CEO is saying it.
Guy (21:15):
The medium is the message. The one thing that you cannot, we can VFX, we can VFX a spaceship into things I've taken like moles off of people's faces. And like, I dunno, like weird like, I dunno, just like we can do anything. We can make people save virtually anything. The only thing we can not edit into a video is authenticity is like somebody saying it like how they mean it. So stop trying to be so perfect in what is being said and focus on how it's being said. I would rather your CEO or whoever flub, then look fake, because think about it. If your customer sees this fake thing, what is the brand impression they're not going to go like, oh wow. The CEO really said all these words. They're not going to say that there's really like, he looks scared. What's wrong with trouble.
Guy (22:15):
Like, all of the things are transmitting. All the subtext is terrible. So like that's a big offender and then here's a quick hack. Or, or the other thing I would say never, never do. I'll give you a quick hack to come up with a really good idea is put these two constraints on yourself. And by default, your ideas will be more human and more relatable. The two constraints are use people and number two, get out of the office or your workplace. You cannot shoot it in your office or workplace because that's the other thing companies do is they go, oh, we should make a video. Yeah. Let's just do it in the conference room by getting it out of your office or workplace, it's forcing you into perhaps maybe your customer's point of view or your, or their environment, or at least it's not your home turf. That's going to make you more relatable. And then by using people just by default, it's more human, it's less robotic and less stock footage and just kind of unhuman, uncanny stuff. Those two constraints will get you really far down the idea path.
Kathleen (23:35):
What is your take on the use of stock video footage? When should you, when did you not, you talked about the footage of the people looking and pointing at the computer. I feel like that's, you know, a common offender.
Guy (23:53):
Yeah. And I mean, even at the super bowl, there was some controversy where two spots use the same shot. I remember that you know what, and COVID kinda changed my mind. So I used to be very anti stock, like no, never. And COVID, you know what, there was no choice. We couldn't shoot. So we, we did some spots with stock. I don't think it's necessarily the stock that bothers me. What it is is that people get lazy when they use stocks. So they they'll do an interview and then just put stock over it or they'll copy and paste words from their product page and just make that their voiceover script. And so and then just put stock over it. Stock kind of is a symptom or it enables laziness. Those Superbowl spots, which use stock. I really didn't care that they use the same shot.
Guy (24:52):
And I wouldn't even notice if anyone pointed it out. And I didn't even know which spots use stock in which spots didn't because those spots are all done by really good agencies who focused on the idea first. And so if the words you are saying are clever and the point of view, and the idea is unique, then the stock really doesn't matter. So it's not about the stock being good or bad, it's that 99% of the time stock enables a lazy approach. So focus on what is being said first, rather than just like the visuals.
Kathleen (25:29):
Next question is, this is the other debate. I hear a lot about like, oh, we can't do a video unless it's like super, super polished versus like, is, are, is there ever a time when less call it polished footage? Like something you took on your iPhone or something like that, like when you would use that kind of a footage?
Guy (25:54):
So I am not a believer that everything needs to be polished. In fact, some of our most successful like marketing for our own agency is done on an iPhone with no lights and no anything. These there's a rule of thumb we use, and then I have like another kind of metaphor. But the rule of thumb we use is the further up the funnel, the more money you should be spending. So awareness, you spend your money there by the time decision, do that on a loom or a BombBomb or your iPhone, whatever. Because as people get further down the funnel, you don't need to impress them any, you don't need to inspire them anymore. Like now they just need to be reassured. And actually the medium being the message, if I'm close to buying from you, and then you have a low fi product walkthrough from one of your product team, and it's not polished, but it's like a guy or a gal walking me through the software.
Guy (26:54):
And they're like sorry about that. That actually reassures me. The medium is the message like, oh, look, there's, they have a person, you know? And like this person is knowledgeable great. It's it's actually reassuring me. That's the rule of thumb. The other thing I would think of is this is, it keeps going back to the idea is, oh, so many people make the mistake of doing like really high fidelity recordings of low fidelity things. So like they'll spend a ton of money on a production. And then what, what are they actually shooting? Is they're shooting. Not a great idea, like a low fidelity thing, just reverse. That is I'd rather you do a low fidelity recording, like a low fidelity capture, meaning iPhone or whatever of a high fidelity thing. Meaning a great idea. Dollar shave club is not done on the best camera.
Guy (27:52):
It's already almost a decade old at this point. So the technology is way better. Now it didn't have good color correction. The audio was, man. It didn't matter. It's the idea. It's the idea that was being transmitted. That is what made it amazing. So always go with idea first, make your ideas high fidelity. And then, Hey, the best thing is high fidelity recording of a high fidelity idea. That's the ultimate. But if you need to make a sacrifice on budget, always lower, how you're doing it, like the recording method. So again, case in point, one of our most effective videos done on an iPhone, it's a really awesome idea done on an iPhone and no one cared. I got no hate mail. Well on
Kathleen (28:39):
Some iPhone cameras are pretty good these days too. Yeah. Yeah.
Guy (28:43):
And like, but no one was like, well, I have to pick a bone with you guys. The lighting on them was not soft, not done through a half grid on a four by floppy. Like they didn't care. So yeah, don't get too precious about how it looks if you got to focus on the idea.
Kathleen (29:03):
So, all right. That brings me then back to what I brought up at the beginning, which is what do you do when someone comes to you and says, I want to make a viral video.
Guy (29:13):
Don't we all? Yeah. Yeah. Well, a viral video is basically what, what a viral video is. The definition of a viral video is you didn't have to pay for the views. Right? Like it just went on its own. And and and like, yeah, just kind of went crazy, went viral. Don't think that that's not realistic. That is just it's happenstance, it's luck, whatever, what you can is focus on what I call like kind of a slippery video or a video that has very low friction. So it's 2021. If your brand is not apple or like known, no one really cares. So you're going to have to pay for views. You will. Now here's where creativity comes into play in ideas is that if you, if you have a good idea, your video will be more efficient. Your, your money will be better, spent more efficiently spent and you'll get some natural traction, you'll get some shares you'll get comments and likes and stuff like that. So that's where quality of the concept is it's not going to get you a viral video. It's just going to get you a more efficient spend on your paid. And please do not be under the impression that you can make an ad and put it on YouTube. And that's when you're done. Maybe that was in 2008, not anymore. You have to have a paid media strategy and not just paid, but earned, shared and owned as well.
Kathleen (30:58):
So you just talked about putting videos on YouTube and that made me think of another question, which is the, the age old question of how long should your video be? I know the answer is it depends, but what does it depend on?
Guy (31:14):
It depends on where your customer is in their cycles. So if it is a demo, I would say as long as possible, actually like go as deep as possible because no, one's watching a demo when they're just on kind of a research terror like there, when they're like, really just like really high up in the funnel. They're not going to sit through a 10 minute demo, but again, as they move down the funnel into the reassure phase of their journey, the more content you give them, the better they're soaking it up. They're trying not to mess up. No one wants to like mess up this, right. Especially in the area we operate in is B2B is, you know, careers are on the line. So the more info you can give them the better top of funnel, like if you're doing something and your brand, and you're making a brand awareness play short and sweet, I'm saying, I used to say no longer than 90 now if you're doing awareness, like if you're longer than 30 at this point, like forget about it.
Kathleen (32:23):
But we all have like functional ADD, right?
Guy (32:25):
Oh my gosh. And our best performer from our own agency is a 15 second spot that I wasn't even excited about putting online. I didn't think it was anything. I thought it had no meat on the bone. It had, it's so simple. And so short yet is so effective. And so, and that's the thing is we, we make this big assumption that everyone cares so much, that everyone will pay attention. If we make it, they will watch it. And that's just not the case. You, you, you have to earn the attention that you're getting. And and, and you have to do that through delivering value in the actual video, like the actual video has to be entertainment value, and then on the tail end, you get to market to them, but you have to entertain first. And so, yeah, I would say if it's further up the funnel short, short, short, and then as it moves down, as a person moves down your funnel, they're giving you more permission. They're giving you more attention. They're saying, Hey, I'm interested in this. I'm going to pay attention. So your videos and content further, they move down can be longer and, and full of more detail, but don't think you can do some kind of 92nd awareness thing. It's not going to work. They're not going to give you the attention.
Kathleen (33:53):
All right. Changing gears for a minute. You've said that you've had, you've had some videos that have performed really well, that customers love. Can you just share a couple of examples of videos that have really like nailed it? And what do you think it was about them that resulted in that success
Guy (34:12):
Of our videos for top one of the big four consulting companies? It's so weird. I can't say their name, but you can go on our site and see who they are. But boy you know, when you think of big four counting you would think it's gotta be boring and quite frankly, their competition are all boring. And then a lot of times in the competitive analysis, I'll show my clients inside this company, like, look at your competitors, they're all the same video. It's, it's literally the same thing. And so this one is pretty risky. Clients were willing to go and kind of write us a a creative blank check. And we went for it and it's this metaphor kind of, of, of AI and supply chain. And it has just worked so well for them. They actually, other companies have seen it and have licensed it, like for them to, to explain supply chain and the, and I try to like, what is it about this spot?
Guy (35:17):
What is it about this spot that like everyone loves? And the thing I can come up with is that it's really beautiful. Like it's like visually stunning. And then also it is so simple on, and it it talk to you like it doesn't explain things instead, it assumes you're smart and assumes you'll get it. And it actually makes you it poses questions. Like it's, it's like, what is going on here? It's a little confusing in the beginning. It's but isn't it, aren't those, the best TV shows like mad men where they're like slightly weird what is going on? Or I love breaking bad, you know, the first part of breaking bad, or like I'm lost, you know, or better call Saul, same thing. They'll do these like 10 minute things where you're like, I have no idea what's happening, but there's like, I need to find out what's happening.
Guy (36:17):
And actually that's engagement. That's your audience, like leaning forward. Like what's going to happen? Like what, what do you think's going to happen? And those are the two factors, I think it's that it treats the audience with respect. And as soon as you're smart and then it also makes you kind of like, think like, yeah, like what's going on here. And then I think also the secret hack I have is that when I look at the most successful ads, the most successful videos they fit into, they have to have one of the three following components. And this works about 90% of the time. There's 10% exceptions, but if you just look at anything you like, it's going to fit into one of these three buckets. It's beautiful, funny, or it makes you cry. And for this spot, I think it's really beautiful people, just like pretty things is just what we do.
Guy (37:12):
We like it. So that's a really successful spot. And then we did another one for a stock music company. And it was like a, like a comedy bit premium beat.com. And that just like blew up in our industry. And and that's with a, like a very niche audience too. And the, and that was funny. And the other thing I love to talk about the, the, the factor that was effective of that spot is that it's an inside joke. If you can, like, if your audience, especially in B2B, you should see some of the personas we do. I mean, they're very niche audiences, like where there's not a lot of these people in the world with this title. But what we try to do is dig out of our clients like inside jokes, like jokes that are known just in this audience.
Guy (38:10):
If you can make an inside joke to a very specific audience, they're gonna, they're going to like what they, they're just gonna think that you're you get them. It's almost like you read their mind. You will ingratiate yourselves to them on a level that your competitors can never. Right. So that was the thing, the factor, I think that spot has a really good inside joke and it, what it does, is it just the medium, the underlying subtext is we get you, we empathize. Like we're one of you. And so, yeah. Make an inside joke.
Kathleen (38:45):
I feel like that's anything with marketers having to do with how you pronounce Jif versus GIF. All right, well now we're really going to switch into a different mode. I have two questions that I always ask my guests. And I'm curious to hear your answers. The first is, of course, this podcast is all about inbound marketing. Is there a particular company or individual that you think is really knocking it out of the park when it comes to inbound marketing these days?
Guy (39:11):
Hmm. Well, I mean, I'm sure you've heard HubSpot.
Kathleen (39:16):
You can't say HubSpot.
Guy (39:16):
That's true. It's so good though. Like every time I have any question, I put it in it's, there's a HubSpot, like not just article, but there's like a 80 page guide and that was easy. I really like, oh, what's their name? They do the chat. Dave Gerhardt is drift, so good. So good. And then also in our sphere, in the marketing sphere, there's a guy named David C. Baker. and I find him, his material is so great. Like he really, if you were to assemble his blog articles, you really don't have to hire him. He's that generous? Like with his thinking? Obviously you'll never do that, so you'll still hire him, but like, it's, he has no there's and he also hates content upgrades, which I do too. I think you just give it away, just earn it. And so he really is so generous and his thought leadership is just amazing. And so if you get caught up into his inbound marketing funnel, like there's no getting out, it's just like sucks you in to an engagement. He's so good.
Kathleen (40:35):
I have to agree with you. I owned a digital agency for 11 years and I read all of his stuff and I also appreciate about him. And one of the reasons I think he's successful is he has a very strong point of view and he's not afraid to be like controversial. You know, like I remember I went to hear him speak at a conference and he was like, everybody tells agency owners that they should be focusing on growing their agency. And that's just. Nobody should grow for growth's sake. And like, he just, he takes on these common tropes and in a very like fearless way, which I appreciate. So that is a good one. All right. Second question. A lot of marketers, I talk to say that their biggest challenge is just keeping up with all the changes in the world of digital marketing and staying on top of them. So are there, other than David Baker, are there any particular sources that you rely on to keep yourself educated enough to date?
Guy (41:28):
Yeah. so I have this, I was a Google reader fan, and then they shut it down in the, in like the lower teens. And so now there's this thing called Feedly and what it does is it just aggregates all your blogs into one thing and you just hit your J key and it just like moves down a list of all the blogs. And so that's what I do every morning. I just scan like whatever whatever on my feed. I find, you know, there's macro stuff that I think Ad Age and AdWeek is good for. I don't play in that league. You know, those huge CPG
Kathleen (42:08):
And you're not going for a Cannes Lions.
Guy (42:11):
No one will, I'll never win those. But it's really good to see, like, cause that is a view. If you think about like what Nike is doing and what those consumer brands are doing, that's like bleeding edge. Right. So, and that's stuff that's, that's almost like high fashion, right. That eventually will become surly and blue in a couple of years or whatever from devil wears Prada. So like, it's really good to know like what that level is doing. Because then I'm sure there's stuff that like filters into the brain of how we can transpose it over to B2B. So I liked the macro stuff. And then and Hadley great. Oh my gosh. Now I'm forgetting his name. Plaid suit.
Kathleen (42:58):
Oh, Jay Baer.
Guy (42:59):
Yeah. Jay Baer.
Kathleen (43:01):
So funny that you said plaid suit and I knew exactly who you were talking about.
Guy (43:04):
Convince, convert. Yeah. and then I also really LinkedIn Learning. They're on it. Like when you watch their courses, they're all up to date. Like, it's not like it's not Google platforms from three years ago or even last year, it's like fresh. So I really do like LinkedIn Learning and every day I start with a lesson from LinkedIn Learning and right now I'm on a Google ads, advanced course. And I find if you just keep doing one thing a day and that's where I like the idea of the feed, because it just gets in your brain. I'm not reading in-depth articles every day, but it's just like flowing through my brain of what exists. And then maybe three months from now, I'll remember, like, I know there's some article and then I'll go on like a two hour search. I should have like Evernote, but I don't do that. But I think it's important to just know what's swirling around and then you can leverage it when you need it.
Kathleen (44:03):
Yeah. Well, I love those suggestions. And if you want to see any examples of Guy's videos had to the Umault website. If somebody has a question or wants to connect with you, what is the best way for them to do that?
Guy (44:19):
Yeah, best way is just through our website. Umault.com. And we also have, I wrote a book Death to the Corporate Video available on Amazon and actually David C Baker's label published it. And then also have a podcast by the same name, Death to the Corporate Video.
Kathleen (44:38):
I'll put links to all of those things in the show notes. So head there if you want to learn more about Guy and the work that he's doing. This was a ton of fun Guy. You know, if, if somebody is listening, if you're, if you're listening and you liked this I would love it if you'd had to apple podcasts and leave the podcast a review and if you know somebody else like Guy, who's doing amazing inbound marketing work, send me a tweet at @workmommywork, and I could feature them as my next guest. But in the meantime for this week, thank you so much for joining me Guy. This was great.
Guy (45:13):
Thanks Kathleen. It was awesome. All right. Have a great week.
